Massimo, if you like we could discuss North Korea too, but before we begin with it I would like to hear what exactly do you consider as propaganda? (From what I sad about Cuba).
"… many…Castro and Cuba and their system but I am not one of them... Cuba is a very mislead country where the President and his brother have everything and the people practicly nothing. It was not without reason that Castro and Tito was good friends."
Don't believe in American propaganda. Cubans, as well as the rest of South American continent are victims of American foreign policy in the same way as we are, but they are enduring it much longer. It is true that average living standard in Cuba is very low compared to Western Europe, but keep in mind that Cuba is 50 years under economic embargo and isolation. It is an island with a limited natural resources. Still, believe it or not, average Cuban has much better quality of life, (average life expectancy, health, literacy, social security, nutrition, housing….), then most of the people in South American countries who's governments are in friendly relations with US, and blindly follow US economic "wisdom".
Derex,
And just what makes you think we even want to join the SAA?
Serbia is defending what is hers and any other country would react the same or be even more aggressive against separatists and terrorists trying to steal 15% of its territory. What do you think the US would do if southern California tried to join Mexico? I will tell you what, they would send in the army! What would your own Holland do if separatists with high birth rates became a majority on one corner of your country and declared independence? I would like to hear your answer.
One thing you must realize is that Kosovo is Serbian, historically, culturally, geographically, linguistically, and morally. Why do you think the albanians in Kosovo have burned 150 Serbian churches, some of which are UNESCO heritage sites? Why do you think they have constructed 400 mosques? Why do Serbs live behind barbed wire in Kosovo today, why do they need military escorts to go shopping for food?
Because albanians are trying to wipe out the truth about Kosovo, trying to wipe out its history. Because of people like you who support them, they have almost reached their goal. ALMOST being the key word. Enough is enough. No more. Serbia will not give an inch of Kosovo, and will bide its time to take back sovereignty. The Russian veto guarantees Kosovo is legally Serbian, and you and those of your ilk can do nothing about that.
Please don't preach to me like you understand the balkans and know what you are talking about. What you need is a good dose of truth, and less albanian propoganda. Go visit your beloved albanians and see 'ghettos' of Serbs behind barbed wire, yes 'ghettos', which still exist in the 21'st century. Shame.
But when the International Community forgets you and stops financialy helping you (and trust me they will) not even your "GREAT" polititians are going to be able to help any more even with their "excellent" tactics. But they won't suffer as much, 'cause I'm sure their bank accounts are already packed...
"Then it will be the right time to take back full control of Kosovo"
So you mean if the inhabitants of a land decide to exercise their right to self determination and succeed, later on the political situation will change and let the "Serbian army ready to pounce at any minute"?
What would you say if the Hungarian army would decide and take back Vojvodina on the same basis that it belonged to Hungarians (for 900 years!), well before the Serbs settled down there?
Hopefully the political situation will never be ready for what you envisage, because Serbia would be taken apart quickly by neighbouring states with territorial claims, much more justifiable than this "cradle of our culture" thing.
1. Read the history of the Balkans as it is obvious that your knowledge is lacking.
(Tom O'Donoghue, 28 January 2008 23:27)
So I guess you have read the history of Balkans then, and that gives you the authority to judge others historic views.
I wonder which version of the Balkans History did you read (I dear to believe, the one where Balkan = Serbia, Serbia = Balkan).
Now let’s go to point nr 3
(Cease worrying about Serbian "isolation". This is a country that has a fantastic future ahead of it and only its own people will decide which way to go.”).
I will say the same about Kosova. Kosova is a country that has a fantastic future ahead of it and only its own people will decide which way to go.
And finally to point 4:
(Eliminate your arrogance which considers Holland & Western Europe to be the centre of the universe.).
So instead, everybody must accept that Serbia is the centre of the universe then, right.
Involving and encouraging the most vulnerable of society, the young and the elderly, to be part of such irrational and sick behavior is beyond description.
Some of these tit for tat comments here remind me of a vulgar spitting match.
(Roger7, 28 January 2008 20:30)
Roger,
I guess you never lived in Kosova then.
Do you think that Albanians had cakes to eat during Serbian regime?
Do you think Albanians had the needed employment during Serbian regime?
So I don’t put too many “Do you-s” I will do the abbreviated version below:
Do you think that Albanians had anything during the Serbian regime?
No Roger, Albanians had none of them (nothing).
So being hungry is something that Albanians are used to.
Let me put it this way.
If you were starving for 100 years and you know that you have to endure the hunger for a bit longer what would you do?
Would you say yes to that or, would you choose to get few breadcrumbs and then stay hungry for another 100 years.
The older generation is willing to do that so they can finally breathe the long awaited air of freedom.
The young ones are willing to starve because they do not want to experience what their parents (and grandparents) have endured for a long time.
The rest (20-60) are willing to starve because they want the best for their children.
So if you still believe that this is a “vulgar spiting match”, think again.
I do appreciate that there are definitely comments put in this forum that are put just for the heck of it.
These (Uncletonny’s and Xheffo’s) are not.
These represent the will of the nation.
I guess you have to be Kosova Albanian to understand that.
KS, sorry that my english isn't the best, what I meant in my post when refering to "ransions" in Cuba I mixed up the word with another language.
I meant that you cant buy basic stuff such as milk, eggs, flour, imported goods, peterol in the stores in Cuba without a "coupon"
They have a system where each family or individual (I don't know exactly how it works) gets monthly coupons and then they can only buy a limited number of goods if they have the coupon with them.
The same system that many european countries used during WW2 when goods and merchandize were hard to get.
I know that many serbs defend Castro and Cuba and their system but I am not one of them... Yes, they have free health care and good educationsystem, but thats about it. Cuba is a very mislead country where the President and his brother have everything and the people practicly nothing. It was not without reason that Castro and Tito was good friends.
so -- b92 -- good old "progressive" b92... aren't you so proud of yourselves? you regularly CENSOR (look it up) my historical/political opinions (i'm so sorry that you are the ultimate experts about ww2 and everything else) and then regularly publish put-downs and threats against those albanian "thugs." who is in control there? inquiring minds just wanna know. whatever -- you seem fully prepared for the coming regime, and i mean it w/ utmost sincerity. i am always so proud of your evolution, and how very progressive and intellectual you have become.
"Kate, right now Im in middle of Prishtina, and I live here, AND yes, Im ready, my kids and my old mother are ready to starve for independence!!
(xheffo, 28 January 2008 18:45)"
Nobody's going to starve with the UDI. But the de facto border will be at the Ibar whether you like it or not.
Since 1999 Kosovo has developed into 2 separate ethnic-based societies.
Kosovo sells electricity to its neighbors while it can not provide it to its own because it is probably the only LEGAL export it bring the rest of the world. Terrorism, drugs, women, guns, and nationalism, are not really providers of GDP for a state.
As you could realize Serbia does not really want that much to be in the EU club. To be honest I am glad that Netherlands did not give permission for SAA. Nonetheless, just enjoy your wealthy life in the Netherlands and let's us live in our poverty and fight for something that it belongs to us. Your knowledge on Balkan situation, especially Kosovo is very limited as I could conclude from your post referring to ex Yu. Before you post your comment, please do some extensive reading one the Serbian history. Perhaps you already have red some Albanian interpretation of the history which is full of falsified facts, or perhaps you are just informed form the very objective media. The newest falsification is assuming Serbian churches as those churches were their own.
I have no problem with your opinion and your great support for the Albanian cause but you have no right to insult Serbs. Speaking of Mladic and crimes he committed while Dutch Army was taking care of the Moslems in Bosnia,I think that Dutch have little to say or to be ashamed to talk about that event as they were directly involved and responsible as much as the Serbs were. I guess this makes us equal. Your Dutch Army did not try to do anything to prevent that crime and that was their obligation.
I wish you sometimes in the future to experience just one piece of what Serbs experience now. I wish you to face the real problems with your immigrants who will claim to live there for centuries and assume your culture as their own.
Don't bother to reply, especially don't bother to replay me with falsified so called historical facts and especially don't bother to replay explaining that Albanians are not immigrants.
Derex, I think you should:
1. Read the history of the Balkans as it is obvious that your knowledge is lacking.
2. Get over the fact that your "peacekeepers" failed in every respect in Bosnia.
3. Cease worrying about Serbian "isolation". This is a country that has a fantastic future ahead of it and only its own people will decide which way to go.
4. Eliminate your arrogance which considers Holland & Western Europe to be the centre of the universe.
P.S. how it comes that there are not Serbian Byzantian style churches northern then Nis. Ask yourself.
Occupying does not mean being yours.
(ben, 28 January 2008 19:30)
I am speechless.
but, if one thing is sure, than it is that those churches are all of serbian-byzantine origin.
since you say that they are albanian... why are you burning them down then?
are those who are burning serbian churches down just stupid, or are you lying?
I know that you can´t answer the only right answer: no church at should be burning. but Albanians in Kosovo are burning down churches. and that is the fact that all the world can see...
"Im ready, my kids and my old mother are ready to starve for independence."
Get a grip!
Involving and encouraging the most vulnerable of society, the young and the elderly, to be part of such irrational and sick behavior is beyond description.
Some of these tit for tat comments here remind me of a vulgar spitting match.
Besides the electricity problem that will hurt us a little, everything that we buy from Serbia can be bought in Albania. Actually, it was time to stop buying anything from you guys, so that Albanian merchants take over Kosova market. Who do you think you are hurting...pfffff...what a joke. We have been having power cuts for years now, so from not having 12 hrs/day to 16 hrs/day will only make us sleep better and relax. Good luck!
They have ransions of every piece of basic grocery, if you don't pay in euro which the average cuban doesn't have.
But the Castro brothers are doing just fine, same as Thaci and Cegu will after the serbian embarbo takes place.
(Srboslav, 28 January 2008 17:49)
Srbsolav I would like to prepare a proper reply but I'm not sure what a "ransion" is.
You used it here, "They have ransions of every piece of basic grocery".
"It is nothing against your culture but simply for safety reasons".
(bmrusila, 28 January 2008 16:53)
bmrusila: this summer Albania was visited by more then 1 million foreign tourists. Dalema, the Italian foreign minister is the habitué frequenter of the Albanian costs.
So just don't worry visit Albania and- enjoy the authentic ancient Mediterranean culture.
P.S. how it comes that there are not Serbian Byzantian style churches northern then Nis. Ask yourself.
Occupying does not mean being yours.
The blockade will happen if the Kosovo albanians insist on trying to steal sacred Serbian land. One thing we need to keep in mind is that Kosovo will always legally belong to Serbia, no matter what happens. This means that Serbia will need to build up its economy, improve the standard of living for all its citizens, and wait for the geopolitical situation in the world to change (it is already changing rapidly). Then it will be the right time to take back full control of Kosovo. What some here don't realize is that they will never have their 'greater albania', they will never have a seat at the UN, in the EU, in FIFA, no westerners would be crazy to invest there. If this is the kind of life they want for their kids, so be it. If they want to accept the fact that they live in Serbia, things will be better. I ask some of the albanian posters from Kosovo on here, are you not rejoicing in your fellow citizens' success success on the tennis courts in Australia? :))
Cheers!
(Dragan, 28 January 2008 15:55)
Wow... so how then do you expect Albanians to live with people as such? With the Serbian Army ready to pounce ("Kill")? How far can you guys go?
But one thing for sure, our government (Netherlands) will never ever allow Serbia to sign SAA without Mladich, just forget it, and as far as I can see there will be no EU and no Kosovo (there never was Kosovo, it was part of Yugoslavia not Serbia, which the latter decided to inherit all what was left from YU, but they didn't get the consensus of majority Kosovo people, which ultimately makes your request for KS dead), for the fact that Kosovo is already 9 years self-administered.
From an international stand point of view, I see Serbia isolated, in darkness of years 90s, all the countries in the region have agreed to recognize Kosovo (Albania, Macedonia, Montenegro, ...) so according to Serbian politician which said that they will take measures for the countries that recognize Kosovo, it means that Serbia will then isolate itself from the region and the world, since it won't have any diplomatic relation with the mentioned countries above.
Well, also talking about the poverty, I see a lot of Serbs are writing that Kosovo is so poor and all that, but I don't see Serbia standing much better either, actually Serbia has even another much bigger problem and that is old population which is in contrast with Kosovo, so speaking in terms of problems I think Serbia has work to do in its own backyard.
I have a message to Serbia: People like Dragan will kill your future, and your kids will inherit 90s and face the very same problems you did during the Milosevic era.
LMFAO. Produce your own power??? No wonder the power is only on half the time. It's because Kosavars are producing it. Thanks for clearing that up.
You absoluately have no clue what are you talking about. Since when Serbia is giving free electricity to Kosova. You seem to forget and/or are not aware that we produce our own power and actually sell to our neighborhs.
Get off the subject man.
(Ahmet Isufi, 28 January 2008 11:27
"And guess what: A few days later, northern Kosovo asks for indepedence and Serbia and Russia recognizes it as indepedent."
This would mean that they have recognised Kosovo's independence so it should never happen.
Just because the Albanians may declare independence and have some nations recognise it, that does not mean they are independent. Only until it goes through the UN will it be achieved and as we already know it is blocked there!
So there will never be a need for the North to declare independence as the whole of Kosovo will legally remain a part of Serbia, though perhaps as occupied land.
The real risk now is that the Albanians turn on their protector's (NATO, US, etc..) as they cannot deliver their promise. This is going to get messy but it seems Serbia has the upperhand!
Jovane, your posts are not the only one that is being censored by B92, many of mine are also.
Especially when I am writing about a presidental candidate several lines of complete posts seems to disapear, no need to mention which one since he/she is out of the elections, but thats an indicator that B92 is not pro serb but also equal pro albanian.
However, just to add that your Illyrian history you can sell out to someone who has no clue who the Albanians really are.
(bmrusila, 28 January 2008 16:53)
Bmrusila,
I thought that it was only Jovan allowed to give history lessons about Albanian history.
Well, it seems that you decided to join the academic elite.
In all the honesty I prefer you more than I did Jovan.
However I am going to say the same thing I told him.
Please do not waste our time trying to elaborate on the history of Albanians as viewed by Serbian historians.
“We know who our ancestors are” and “you know where you came from”.
Shall we leave it with this?
I wouldn't be so happy if I was a KS Albanian.
Even if declares indepedence and gets recognized by a few countries, nothing is going to change. UN goes, EU comes, no UN membership no athletic representations, nothing.
And guess what: A few days later, northern Kosovo asks for indepedence and Serbia and Russia recognizes it as indepedent.
I don't think it's gonna work..
One more thing: I hear some people there think they could be EU members sometime. You'd better forget it! Only Croatia and may be Serbia will. The rest of them, no way.
You can ask Mr Sarkozy if you have any doubts.
You have one chance to get things better for you. And that's Mr Nikolic to win the elections.
Ohh the jokes continue. First it's that Kosova is a Serbian cradle and now I hear that Serbia is giving Kosova free electricity???
The only electricity that Serbia tried to export was to the Kosovar - Serbs. The Kosovar-Serbs live on hand outs from KEK and they owe over 80,000,000 Euros for not paying a single utility. It doesn't matter because they are Kosovars.
Also whomever mentioned the debts, Serbia isn't paying them anymore. Why not, I thought Kosova was a Serbian "province"?
Serbian companies are going to lose a lot since there are a few companies that directly depend on Kosovar demand to stay afloat. We all know the exp / imp is 15/14 the main concern is products coming from elsewhere through Serbia into Kosova. Somehow, I am not scared. Cuba is a great example of an embargo that sent the country into a depression---they are doing very very well.
there can´t be done very much to be ready for such a legal move by the righful government.
all in all, the only thing they can do is to hope for international help, which will certainly not be coming forever. and just remember how the Palestinians had to flee, because of an Israeli blockade. those measures can be very effective.
furthermore I´d love to show some of the kids in here their limitations in regard to their "argumentaion", but unfortunately the B92-censors do not post it,( as my last comment which was a direct answer on a comment adressed directly to me ) although it is in no way "including insults, indecencies, racial or national hate messages and intolerance of any kind"...
so, some mislead Tony out there will have to stay uninformed about real facts.
the reasons for that selective approach will remain to be doubtful.
if the last sentence is written in honesty:
" Hateful words are not allowed on B92’s site."
why are they publishing so many of those groundless hate-driven accusations by the k-albanians, which are already proven wrong by science, history and really independent journalism?
The last post of mine was for you but I forgot to name you when replayed. However, just to add that your Illyrian history you can sell out to someone who has no clue who the Albanians really are. When it comes to visiting Albania, I prefer holiday in Turkey as I can be sure that I will be back in one piece and alive. Nonetheless, thank you for invitation, but think I will have to wait many years before I can feel really safe while visiting Albania. It is nothing against your culture but simply for safety reasons.
Did you suddenly decide to care about the people in Kosova???
Well let’s put it this way:
You care about what happens to Kosova Albanians as much as I care about rugby.
Well well well I see some guys here start talking about post independence time, good, I am not afraid of their comments because they use to say a same things about independence also so now they are talking about post independence time which means that they realized that independence is done deal. Well just to join your discussion, Albania just offered all their ports and roads and airports to Kosova in case of any "blockade", also Macedonia done a same thing because some how they have to, also Montenegro did a same thing because they know how much money they can get out of it, so, blockage, in actuality this will help and also will make an imperative for Kosova to united with Albania sooner then predicted because our markets will join together and we will become more inter dependent to each other where only formalities will be left to be done. I thing serbs still didn't learn the lesson from "blockages" but they still have the opportunity to learn.
The newest falsification of the history by the Albanians is their claim of Serbian orthodox churches and monasteries as their own- Albanian Byzantine ? You should do some reading and educate for yourself. Why do you print brochures and introduce Serbian cultural heritage as the Albanian Byzantine culture. Please, that is called falsification.
Serbian government knows that Kosovo is not surrounded by Serbia, right.
So, a blockade from the “north-north/east and east” is a “blockade from the north-north/east and east” (it does what it says on the tin).
Can somebody enlighten me on geography a bit please?
Doesn’t that leave………………south, part of the west and south east free?
Has somebody informed Serbian government that there seem to be a slight flaw in their plan?
They should of occupied Macedonia, Montenegro and Albania before they thought of this.
Again geography is not my strong point but does that not mean that we can do business with the rest of the word!
Not all the roads go through Serbia, there are one or two that bypass them (believe it or not).
You forgot to say that the four horsemen of the apocalypse will descend from the heavens and visit havoc and destrucion upon all those who dared to break "international law" and threaten the sovreignty of Serbia granted by the almighty himself in return for the protection of Europe from the legions of islam.
You know, you scare me sometimes with your doomsday scenarios.
You forgot to say that the four horsemen of the apocalypse will descend from the heavens and visit havoc and destruction upon all those who dared to break "international law" and threaten the sovereignty of Serbia granted by the almighty himself in return for the protection of Europe from the legions of Islam in the field of the blackbirds.
You know, you scare me sometimes with your doomsday scenarios.
If your ready to starve for indep, then starve. You dreams of indep over shadow the reality of what it takes to be an indep state. Investments are pouring into Serbia all the time. Its only a matter of time before the people turn on their heros in Prirtina because their starving. Kosovo is not ready to be indep because it has no economy to support it. If Serbia puts a total blockade on Kosovo it will cripal the almost nonexistant economy there. So if indep is more important than future stability, you cant blame Serbia for Pristinas failure in securing a normal future for its people since indep is the only thing that unites the people.
if economic blockade will be enforced, the law of supply and demand will tell us that demand will be high, supply will be low so the price will be high. people has nothing to eat and they freeze in the cold without electricity, chaos will follow. then we have a new gaza in the balkans.
The blockade will happen if the Kosovo albanians insist on trying to steal sacred Serbian land. One thing we need to keep in mind is that Kosovo will always legally belong to Serbia, no matter what happens. This means that Serbia will need to build up its economy, improve the standard of living for all its citizens, and wait for the geopolitical situation in the world to change (it is already changing rapidly). Then it will be the right time to take back full control of Kosovo. What some here don't realize is that they will never have their 'greater albania', they will never have a seat at the UN, in the EU, in FIFA, no westerners would be crazy to invest there with the Serbian army ready to pounce at any minute, they will never be able to live at ease. If this is the kind of life they want for their kids, so be it. If they want to accept the fact that they live in Serbia, things will be better. I ask some of the albanian posters from Kosovo on here, are you not rejoicing in your fellow citizens' success success on the tennis courts in Australia? :))
Cheers!
You know, I see both sides "fighting" a never-ending battle here, everyday!
A small generator (2.5kw) costs 40-45 euros on the market, so people will not starve for "power", on the othe side I see kosovo market is floded with serbian products, although its a 2 mil people market, with the blockade serbia will have to find another 2 mil to sell it to. Kosovars are used to not having power, I dont think there was a day in the last 9 yrs when a day went without power! I dont belong to either side, but have been on the ground for 9 yrs and I know thing or two. As for KLA, you ppl have to stop to bring them up everytime you criticize, they are GONE, been gone for 8 yrs! WAKE UP AND SMELL THE COFFEE, there is no turning back! There are planty of buckets around to carry "power" from the neighbours :)
Srboslav, From east Japan To New Zeland to West Argentina and Canada, 4 corners of the world will know about Kosovo becoming the new nation and recognise that new development that will calm the balkans for a thousand years. Than we will move on and maybe have a trade war and economic monopoly of the region, what ever it takes to make the balkans a prosperous region that should be competative to even the eu bloc.
You absoluately have no clue what are you talking about. Since when Serbia is giving free electricity to Kosova. You seem to forget and/or are not aware that we produce our own power and actually sell to our neighborhs.
Get off the subject man.
(Ahmet Isufi, 28 January 2008 11:27)
Again Ahmet you respond to a comment yes kosovo sell power to albanina at what cost? Denying your own citizens without power to make a buck, when you are selling power to albanina then you deprive kosovo citizens of power for up to 6 hours. Now i see why there are so many outage. If Serbia halts transfer of power where will it come from? Macedonia cannot export it comes from Greece and Bulgaria currently is not selling power. Montenegro gets power from Serbia. So that was just a stupid statement you made my friend remember i lived there for 2 years and i had a real good Generator for up to 4 hours without power.
i can insult our politicians all you want, but somehow they managed to get the support of most of the world for our independence, which is far better than the serbian politicans have managed to do!
(nikshala, 28 January 2008 13:28)
Come on Nick, don’t be so harsh now.
Instead of insulting Serbian politicians we should thank them.
We all keep on arguing here, saying was it KLA, USA or Europe that brought Kosova to this day (the day of independence).
The fact remains that it is the “smart” politics from the “educated” Serbian government that actually did most of the work.
It is their “smart” politics that kept us fighting for the realisation of our dream.
On behalf of all Kosova Albanians I thank them.
It is the same politics today that is alienating Serbs living in Kosova from their neighbours, the same politics that is using Kosova Serbs for their political gains.
Keep on with the good work, I can see only one looser int this game and I am glad to say that is will not be Kosova.
Srboslav: thank you for letting me know that I havn't created nothing in all my life- everything I have I own to you. What an arrogant and ignorance!!!
ups.. you remember what Tadic was saying just a month ago about the economic validity of Kosova???? do you remember 'Trepca is working and Belgrade is building'?
Bm-sila:
the only falsification is yours.
You should know the Albanian culture and language to judge- I know yours!!!
Albanians were always part of the Roman and then Byzantium Empire.
The Byzantium culture is Albanian culture too.
Our flag is Byzantium.
Constantine the Illyrian was ruling in Berat before becoming an Emperor and declaring the Christianity as the official religion in the Roman Empire.
The castle of Berat is of 6 hectares and has 40 Churches (yess 40) of Byzantium style.
Take a tour you don’t need visa and visit Albania. You will find in each angle Byzantium Churches even of the 4-5th century. Take a tour my friend http://www.albania-holidays.com/
Learn better your history and you will find your roots based on our history my friend.
You will find St. Cyril and Methodius trained and send to mission (by Byzantium) to civilize/Christianize the Slavs in the north (Serbs etc) using the religion as main ‘tool’, building churches in the occupied Byzantium lends by Slavs- that’s how you got the churches in Kosova- it was your UNI for civilization.
When Slavs were stronger they were penetrating Byzantium territories more in south when Byzantium had the upper hand they were going and liberating their lands in north- till today , with the independent KOSOVA.
When the Austro-Hungarian empire imposed a blockade against Serbia, in the long run it did Serbia a favour as it sought and found other markets and made its economy more versatile. This in an age with much more primitive transport and communication infrastructure and limited markets.
If Serbia decides to take such steps, Kosovo will have short-term difficulties, but as in the example above, it will probably benefit in the long run. The same goes for Serbia. The companies that export to Kosovo will suffer until they find somewhere else to sell.
No doubt the blockade will be damaging to both sides but it will not change the end result regarding Kosovo's status.
Tim,
I don't know how familiar you are with Kosovo in the 1990s but Kosovars survived despite Serbia, not because of it!
nikshala: "i can insult our politicians all you want, but somehow they managed to get the support of most of the world for our independence, which is far better than the serbian politicans have managed to do!
Results speak for themselves"
I think you should post what you mean again as your sentence above doesn't make any sense.
nikshala,
I am not insulting your leaders, every word of what I wrote is truth. Both Thaci and Cegu ARE former guerilla leaders with no political experience. And both have a history of violence, Cegu in Krajina and Thaci in Kosovo.
Is that is a good experience for current politicans? No, not if you ask me, but you might se it differently.
And you are very wrong, most of the world does not support Kosovo independence, a few EU countries + USA and Taiwan does not make up most of the world. Infact most countries are against illegal independece for Kosovo
I accept as true that some on this forum may eventually be experts in the electricity business however I believe that (perhaps because of that and their accumulated hate) they are at the same time missing the point here. We are not talking about markets. A new country becoming independent after decades of starving under some cruel and illegitimate rule is about diplomacy, negotiation, alliances, power, momentum, … and luck. We should all wish luck to Kosovo. Serbia is not going to be better off when Kosovars are starving. It didn’t work and it’s not working!
Uncletonny: "Trust me, we are ready to even starve for our independence."
But... don't you live in the UK?! And what about the kids and old people in Kosovo? Do they have any say about whether they 'starve' for independence?
I read a truly dire report at the weekend about the average incomes in Kosovo which are something like half of what they are in Romania. People are really poor and things extremely tough - why would they want to 'starve'? A significant proportion of them are already listed as under-nourished. You are being so casual about it.
I still say that it's not too late for some sort of agreement to be drawn up. Kosovo is legally part of Serbia and a province can't just be handed independence.
There will be major ramifications for everyone if this isn't sorted out in a mutally acceptable fashion.
If UDI is declared there will be immediate partition, embargoes and a diplomatic nightmare internationally.
Its only fair to respond back to person calling all Albanians thugs.
You serboslav and your thugs in Belgrade don't have a clue what is going on in your own yard let alone Kosova.
"The power Serbia has over Kosova is best noticed when walking through Mother Theresa Boulevard with the Scanderbeg Statue on the right and that of Zahir Pajaziti on the left. You have no power in Kosova and you know it.
Headline of the article is "Kosovo readies for blockade", ready means whatever it takes! And by now, serb-camp should realise, as all democratic countries in a world that Kosovars are peace loving people and KNOW what they want.
The power Serbia has over Kosova is best noticed when walking through Mother Theresa Boulevard with the Scanderbeg Statue on the right and that of Zahir Pajaziti on the left. You have no power in Kosova and you know it.
Brumsila,
Power Plant Kosova "B" which supplies Kosova with most of its energy and the existing transmission netowrk was constructed using funds from the "Fund for Undeveloped Regions" of the SFRJ. Kosova benefited from that fund as a federal entity. Serbia had nothing to do with it except contribute its "share" of the money in the concerned fund.
Cutting off electricity, economic blockade, whatever.
The Serbian government has devised an action plan in the event of a UDI. Nothing that any of us say on this forum will change that. Nor will it change anything that Thaci & Co decide to do. So let things take their course and it will become apparent who is bluffing. After all, Serbia can stand on its own two feet unlike Kosovo which is a basket case living on charity.
Two things that will have an effect on all this:
1. The international economy is very rocky and unstable. An international recession is looming. In such a situation, Kosovo will no longer be able to rely on continuing handouts.
2. George Bush and his cronies are on the way out. The day of the neo-cons is over. Do not underestimate the importance of this to US foreign policy.
"This is normal behaviour when were dealing with politcal leaders that come from a guerilla backbground with no political experince other than violence.
(Srboslav, 28 January 2008 12:41) "
i can insult our politicians all you want, but somehow they managed to get the support of most of the world for our independence, which is far better than the serbian politicans have managed to do!
No I don't belive that you will starve. The fat cats in Pristina will make sure that the albanian people will starve, not them.
And finally the EU will have to pay the bill so the albanians won't starve due to their leaders actions.
This is normal behaviour when were dealing with politcal leaders that come from a guerilla backbground with no political experince other than violence.
Nick,
No you are wrong, "Elektroprivreda Srbije- EPS" does not get paid from KEK. The small amount of money that is payed to EPS comes from the European Union, not albanian authorities.
Ahmet,
The power plants Kosovo1 and Kosovo2 does not belong to KEK, EPS still legally owns them and the fight in courts over who owns them has not even started.
But still, Kosovo1 and Kosovo2 plants can not even supply Kosovo-Metohija with electricity today, to export electricity is not even thought of.
However, Kosovo2 power plant was renovated by the EU, who also payed the bill for it.
Dont talk to me about things YOU have no ide about. I know more about the electricity business than you or the KLA thugs incharge in Pristina ever will.
Do you know how much Serbia pays each day Kosovo's debts? You don't know obviously since you can spread here such nonsense. Besides Serbia does not owe anything to Albanians in Kosovo since everything over there that you have it is built by Serbia and therefore Serbia is the owner. Unfortunately Albanians were not involved in Kosovo development but in Kosovo destruction by all means. Perhaps our churches and monasteries too are in your possession, since you assumed as yours and presenting them as the part of the Albanian-Byzantine culture. That is the newest falsification of history.
Let’s see how ingenious Albanians are to overcome the blockade. I have no doubts, there is always solution but the question is how painless will be.
You absoluately have no clue what are you talking about. Since when Serbia is giving free electricity to Kosova. You seem to forget and/or are not aware that we produce our own power and actually sell to our neighborhs.
Get off the subject man.
Illegal unilateral declarations of Dependence will remain illegal and Serbia will strengthen its institutions while those of the illegal institutions will face ever greater challenges - even more form their own!
KEK pays Serbia for every MW of imported energy in hard cash. It is the Serbian energy company that owes the Kosova Transmission Network Operator millions of Euro for using the Kosova network to export energy to other neighbouring countries.
If suffering Energy cuts is the price we have to pay for independence that i think everyone in Kosova is more than fine with that.
"If suffering Energy cuts is the price we have to pay for independence that i think everyone in Kosova is more than fine with that."
Just as Serbs are now choosing prosperity over Radicals you are doing the opposite, and some of you have the cheek to mention your little "kosova" into the EU, please dont make me laugh.
"kosova" will crumble from within when the Serbian govenment shows it's hand because believe it or not Serbs have more power over you than the Americans do half way round the world.
And how would the "kosovan" governement solve the enegry crisis if Serbia decide not to give any free electricity to KEK anymore?
Of course the fat cats in Pristina already have electric generators in their luxury villas, just like the Hamas leadership in Gaza strip. But how should the people get electricity?
Buying from Montenegro is not an option considering that Montenegro themselves have frequent power cuts, and don't have the capacity to deliver electricity to 1.5 million extra people. Makedonia and Albania? Same thing here, they can sell a little, but not compensate for the loss of electricity from Serbia. Neither the transmission lines or the production can fill the void.
But it doesn't matter for the KLA leaders, they won't freaze, theyl let the people do instead. There are more and more similarities between Hamas leadership in Gaza and KLA in Kosovo. Both deserve to get fired as Donald Trump would say!
KEK pays Serbia for every MW of imported energy in hard cash. It is the Serbian energy company that owes the Kosova Transmission Network Operator millions of Euro for using the Kosova network to export energy to other neighbouring countries.
If suffering Energy cuts is the price we have to pay for independence that i think everyone in Kosova is more than fine with that.
And how would the "kosovan" governement solve the enegry crisis if Serbia decide not to give any free electricity to KEK anymore?
Of course the fat cats in Pristina already have electric generators in their luxury villas, just like the Hamas leadership in Gaza strip. But how should the people get electricity?
Buying from Montenegro is not an option considering that Montenegro themselves have frequent power cuts, and don't have the capacity to deliver electricity to 1.5 million extra people. Makedonia and Albania? Same thing here, they can sell a little, but not compensate for the loss of electricity from Serbia. Neither the transmission lines or the production can fill the void.
But it doesn't matter for the KLA leaders, they won't freaze, theyl let the people do instead. There are more and more similarities between Hamas leadership in Gaza and KLA in Kosovo. Both deserve to get fired as Donald Trump would say!
The blockade will happen if the Kosovo albanians insist on trying to steal sacred Serbian land. One thing we need to keep in mind is that Kosovo will always legally belong to Serbia, no matter what happens. This means that Serbia will need to build up its economy, improve the standard of living for all its citizens, and wait for the geopolitical situation in the world to change (it is already changing rapidly). Then it will be the right time to take back full control of Kosovo. What some here don't realize is that they will never have their 'greater albania', they will never have a seat at the UN, in the EU, in FIFA, no westerners would be crazy to invest there with the Serbian army ready to pounce at any minute, they will never be able to live at ease. If this is the kind of life they want for their kids, so be it. If they want to accept the fact that they live in Serbia, things will be better. I ask some of the albanian posters from Kosovo on here, are you not rejoicing in your fellow citizens' success success on the tennis courts in Australia? :))
Cheers!
Srboslav: thank you for letting me know that I havn't created nothing in all my life- everything I have I own to you. What an arrogant and ignorance!!!
ups.. you remember what Tadic was saying just a month ago about the economic validity of Kosova???? do you remember 'Trepca is working and Belgrade is building'?
Bm-sila:
the only falsification is yours.
You should know the Albanian culture and language to judge- I know yours!!!
Albanians were always part of the Roman and then Byzantium Empire.
The Byzantium culture is Albanian culture too.
Our flag is Byzantium.
Constantine the Illyrian was ruling in Berat before becoming an Emperor and declaring the Christianity as the official religion in the Roman Empire.
The castle of Berat is of 6 hectares and has 40 Churches (yess 40) of Byzantium style.
Take a tour you don’t need visa and visit Albania. You will find in each angle Byzantium Churches even of the 4-5th century. Take a tour my friend http://www.albania-holidays.com/
Learn better your history and you will find your roots based on our history my friend.
You will find St. Cyril and Methodius trained and send to mission (by Byzantium) to civilize/Christianize the Slavs in the north (Serbs etc) using the religion as main ‘tool’, building churches in the occupied Byzantium lends by Slavs- that’s how you got the churches in Kosova- it was your UNI for civilization.
When Slavs were stronger they were penetrating Byzantium territories more in south when Byzantium had the upper hand they were going and liberating their lands in north- till today , with the independent KOSOVA.
You forgot to say that the four horsemen of the apocalypse will descend from the heavens and visit havoc and destrucion upon all those who dared to break "international law" and threaten the sovreignty of Serbia granted by the almighty himself in return for the protection of Europe from the legions of islam.
You know, you scare me sometimes with your doomsday scenarios.
You absoluately have no clue what are you talking about. Since when Serbia is giving free electricity to Kosova. You seem to forget and/or are not aware that we produce our own power and actually sell to our neighborhs.
Get off the subject man.
Do you know how much Serbia pays each day Kosovo's debts? You don't know obviously since you can spread here such nonsense. Besides Serbia does not owe anything to Albanians in Kosovo since everything over there that you have it is built by Serbia and therefore Serbia is the owner. Unfortunately Albanians were not involved in Kosovo development but in Kosovo destruction by all means. Perhaps our churches and monasteries too are in your possession, since you assumed as yours and presenting them as the part of the Albanian-Byzantine culture. That is the newest falsification of history.
Let’s see how ingenious Albanians are to overcome the blockade. I have no doubts, there is always solution but the question is how painless will be.
The power Serbia has over Kosova is best noticed when walking through Mother Theresa Boulevard with the Scanderbeg Statue on the right and that of Zahir Pajaziti on the left. You have no power in Kosova and you know it.
Brumsila,
Power Plant Kosova "B" which supplies Kosova with most of its energy and the existing transmission netowrk was constructed using funds from the "Fund for Undeveloped Regions" of the SFRJ. Kosova benefited from that fund as a federal entity. Serbia had nothing to do with it except contribute its "share" of the money in the concerned fund.
Illegal unilateral declarations of Dependence will remain illegal and Serbia will strengthen its institutions while those of the illegal institutions will face ever greater challenges - even more form their own!
I accept as true that some on this forum may eventually be experts in the electricity business however I believe that (perhaps because of that and their accumulated hate) they are at the same time missing the point here. We are not talking about markets. A new country becoming independent after decades of starving under some cruel and illegitimate rule is about diplomacy, negotiation, alliances, power, momentum, … and luck. We should all wish luck to Kosovo. Serbia is not going to be better off when Kosovars are starving. It didn’t work and it’s not working!
nikshala,
I am not insulting your leaders, every word of what I wrote is truth. Both Thaci and Cegu ARE former guerilla leaders with no political experience. And both have a history of violence, Cegu in Krajina and Thaci in Kosovo.
Is that is a good experience for current politicans? No, not if you ask me, but you might se it differently.
And you are very wrong, most of the world does not support Kosovo independence, a few EU countries + USA and Taiwan does not make up most of the world. Infact most countries are against illegal independece for Kosovo
"If suffering Energy cuts is the price we have to pay for independence that i think everyone in Kosova is more than fine with that."
Just as Serbs are now choosing prosperity over Radicals you are doing the opposite, and some of you have the cheek to mention your little "kosova" into the EU, please dont make me laugh.
"kosova" will crumble from within when the Serbian govenment shows it's hand because believe it or not Serbs have more power over you than the Americans do half way round the world.
Nick,
No you are wrong, "Elektroprivreda Srbije- EPS" does not get paid from KEK. The small amount of money that is payed to EPS comes from the European Union, not albanian authorities.
Ahmet,
The power plants Kosovo1 and Kosovo2 does not belong to KEK, EPS still legally owns them and the fight in courts over who owns them has not even started.
But still, Kosovo1 and Kosovo2 plants can not even supply Kosovo-Metohija with electricity today, to export electricity is not even thought of.
However, Kosovo2 power plant was renovated by the EU, who also payed the bill for it.
Dont talk to me about things YOU have no ide about. I know more about the electricity business than you or the KLA thugs incharge in Pristina ever will.
"This is normal behaviour when were dealing with politcal leaders that come from a guerilla backbground with no political experince other than violence.
(Srboslav, 28 January 2008 12:41) "
i can insult our politicians all you want, but somehow they managed to get the support of most of the world for our independence, which is far better than the serbian politicans have managed to do!
You know, I see both sides "fighting" a never-ending battle here, everyday!
A small generator (2.5kw) costs 40-45 euros on the market, so people will not starve for "power", on the othe side I see kosovo market is floded with serbian products, although its a 2 mil people market, with the blockade serbia will have to find another 2 mil to sell it to. Kosovars are used to not having power, I dont think there was a day in the last 9 yrs when a day went without power! I dont belong to either side, but have been on the ground for 9 yrs and I know thing or two. As for KLA, you ppl have to stop to bring them up everytime you criticize, they are GONE, been gone for 8 yrs! WAKE UP AND SMELL THE COFFEE, there is no turning back! There are planty of buckets around to carry "power" from the neighbours :)
"It is nothing against your culture but simply for safety reasons".
(bmrusila, 28 January 2008 16:53)
bmrusila: this summer Albania was visited by more then 1 million foreign tourists. Dalema, the Italian foreign minister is the habitué frequenter of the Albanian costs.
So just don't worry visit Albania and- enjoy the authentic ancient Mediterranean culture.
P.S. how it comes that there are not Serbian Byzantian style churches northern then Nis. Ask yourself.
Occupying does not mean being yours.
The last post of mine was for you but I forgot to name you when replayed. However, just to add that your Illyrian history you can sell out to someone who has no clue who the Albanians really are. When it comes to visiting Albania, I prefer holiday in Turkey as I can be sure that I will be back in one piece and alive. Nonetheless, thank you for invitation, but think I will have to wait many years before I can feel really safe while visiting Albania. It is nothing against your culture but simply for safety reasons.
No I don't belive that you will starve. The fat cats in Pristina will make sure that the albanian people will starve, not them.
And finally the EU will have to pay the bill so the albanians won't starve due to their leaders actions.
This is normal behaviour when were dealing with politcal leaders that come from a guerilla backbground with no political experince other than violence.
Headline of the article is "Kosovo readies for blockade", ready means whatever it takes! And by now, serb-camp should realise, as all democratic countries in a world that Kosovars are peace loving people and KNOW what they want.
i can insult our politicians all you want, but somehow they managed to get the support of most of the world for our independence, which is far better than the serbian politicans have managed to do!
(nikshala, 28 January 2008 13:28)
Come on Nick, don’t be so harsh now.
Instead of insulting Serbian politicians we should thank them.
We all keep on arguing here, saying was it KLA, USA or Europe that brought Kosova to this day (the day of independence).
The fact remains that it is the “smart” politics from the “educated” Serbian government that actually did most of the work.
It is their “smart” politics that kept us fighting for the realisation of our dream.
On behalf of all Kosova Albanians I thank them.
It is the same politics today that is alienating Serbs living in Kosova from their neighbours, the same politics that is using Kosova Serbs for their political gains.
Keep on with the good work, I can see only one looser int this game and I am glad to say that is will not be Kosova.
The newest falsification of the history by the Albanians is their claim of Serbian orthodox churches and monasteries as their own- Albanian Byzantine ? You should do some reading and educate for yourself. Why do you print brochures and introduce Serbian cultural heritage as the Albanian Byzantine culture. Please, that is called falsification.
Cutting off electricity, economic blockade, whatever.
The Serbian government has devised an action plan in the event of a UDI. Nothing that any of us say on this forum will change that. Nor will it change anything that Thaci & Co decide to do. So let things take their course and it will become apparent who is bluffing. After all, Serbia can stand on its own two feet unlike Kosovo which is a basket case living on charity.
Two things that will have an effect on all this:
1. The international economy is very rocky and unstable. An international recession is looming. In such a situation, Kosovo will no longer be able to rely on continuing handouts.
2. George Bush and his cronies are on the way out. The day of the neo-cons is over. Do not underestimate the importance of this to US foreign policy.
If your ready to starve for indep, then starve. You dreams of indep over shadow the reality of what it takes to be an indep state. Investments are pouring into Serbia all the time. Its only a matter of time before the people turn on their heros in Prirtina because their starving. Kosovo is not ready to be indep because it has no economy to support it. If Serbia puts a total blockade on Kosovo it will cripal the almost nonexistant economy there. So if indep is more important than future stability, you cant blame Serbia for Pristinas failure in securing a normal future for its people since indep is the only thing that unites the people.
Its only fair to respond back to person calling all Albanians thugs.
You serboslav and your thugs in Belgrade don't have a clue what is going on in your own yard let alone Kosova.
Serbian government knows that Kosovo is not surrounded by Serbia, right.
So, a blockade from the “north-north/east and east” is a “blockade from the north-north/east and east” (it does what it says on the tin).
Can somebody enlighten me on geography a bit please?
Doesn’t that leave………………south, part of the west and south east free?
Has somebody informed Serbian government that there seem to be a slight flaw in their plan?
They should of occupied Macedonia, Montenegro and Albania before they thought of this.
Again geography is not my strong point but does that not mean that we can do business with the rest of the word!
Not all the roads go through Serbia, there are one or two that bypass them (believe it or not).
Did you suddenly decide to care about the people in Kosova???
Well let’s put it this way:
You care about what happens to Kosova Albanians as much as I care about rugby.
When the Austro-Hungarian empire imposed a blockade against Serbia, in the long run it did Serbia a favour as it sought and found other markets and made its economy more versatile. This in an age with much more primitive transport and communication infrastructure and limited markets.
If Serbia decides to take such steps, Kosovo will have short-term difficulties, but as in the example above, it will probably benefit in the long run. The same goes for Serbia. The companies that export to Kosovo will suffer until they find somewhere else to sell.
No doubt the blockade will be damaging to both sides but it will not change the end result regarding Kosovo's status.
Tim,
I don't know how familiar you are with Kosovo in the 1990s but Kosovars survived despite Serbia, not because of it!
if economic blockade will be enforced, the law of supply and demand will tell us that demand will be high, supply will be low so the price will be high. people has nothing to eat and they freeze in the cold without electricity, chaos will follow. then we have a new gaza in the balkans.
Srboslav, From east Japan To New Zeland to West Argentina and Canada, 4 corners of the world will know about Kosovo becoming the new nation and recognise that new development that will calm the balkans for a thousand years. Than we will move on and maybe have a trade war and economic monopoly of the region, what ever it takes to make the balkans a prosperous region that should be competative to even the eu bloc.
The blockade will happen if the Kosovo albanians insist on trying to steal sacred Serbian land. One thing we need to keep in mind is that Kosovo will always legally belong to Serbia, no matter what happens. This means that Serbia will need to build up its economy, improve the standard of living for all its citizens, and wait for the geopolitical situation in the world to change (it is already changing rapidly). Then it will be the right time to take back full control of Kosovo. What some here don't realize is that they will never have their 'greater albania', they will never have a seat at the UN, in the EU, in FIFA, no westerners would be crazy to invest there. If this is the kind of life they want for their kids, so be it. If they want to accept the fact that they live in Serbia, things will be better. I ask some of the albanian posters from Kosovo on here, are you not rejoicing in your fellow citizens' success success on the tennis courts in Australia? :))
Cheers!
(Dragan, 28 January 2008 15:55)
Wow... so how then do you expect Albanians to live with people as such? With the Serbian Army ready to pounce ("Kill")? How far can you guys go?
But one thing for sure, our government (Netherlands) will never ever allow Serbia to sign SAA without Mladich, just forget it, and as far as I can see there will be no EU and no Kosovo (there never was Kosovo, it was part of Yugoslavia not Serbia, which the latter decided to inherit all what was left from YU, but they didn't get the consensus of majority Kosovo people, which ultimately makes your request for KS dead), for the fact that Kosovo is already 9 years self-administered.
From an international stand point of view, I see Serbia isolated, in darkness of years 90s, all the countries in the region have agreed to recognize Kosovo (Albania, Macedonia, Montenegro, ...) so according to Serbian politician which said that they will take measures for the countries that recognize Kosovo, it means that Serbia will then isolate itself from the region and the world, since it won't have any diplomatic relation with the mentioned countries above.
Well, also talking about the poverty, I see a lot of Serbs are writing that Kosovo is so poor and all that, but I don't see Serbia standing much better either, actually Serbia has even another much bigger problem and that is old population which is in contrast with Kosovo, so speaking in terms of problems I think Serbia has work to do in its own backyard.
I have a message to Serbia: People like Dragan will kill your future, and your kids will inherit 90s and face the very same problems you did during the Milosevic era.
Derex, I think you should:
1. Read the history of the Balkans as it is obvious that your knowledge is lacking.
2. Get over the fact that your "peacekeepers" failed in every respect in Bosnia.
3. Cease worrying about Serbian "isolation". This is a country that has a fantastic future ahead of it and only its own people will decide which way to go.
4. Eliminate your arrogance which considers Holland & Western Europe to be the centre of the universe.
Uncletonny: "Trust me, we are ready to even starve for our independence."
But... don't you live in the UK?! And what about the kids and old people in Kosovo? Do they have any say about whether they 'starve' for independence?
I read a truly dire report at the weekend about the average incomes in Kosovo which are something like half of what they are in Romania. People are really poor and things extremely tough - why would they want to 'starve'? A significant proportion of them are already listed as under-nourished. You are being so casual about it.
I still say that it's not too late for some sort of agreement to be drawn up. Kosovo is legally part of Serbia and a province can't just be handed independence.
There will be major ramifications for everyone if this isn't sorted out in a mutally acceptable fashion.
If UDI is declared there will be immediate partition, embargoes and a diplomatic nightmare internationally.
However, just to add that your Illyrian history you can sell out to someone who has no clue who the Albanians really are.
(bmrusila, 28 January 2008 16:53)
Bmrusila,
I thought that it was only Jovan allowed to give history lessons about Albanian history.
Well, it seems that you decided to join the academic elite.
In all the honesty I prefer you more than I did Jovan.
However I am going to say the same thing I told him.
Please do not waste our time trying to elaborate on the history of Albanians as viewed by Serbian historians.
“We know who our ancestors are” and “you know where you came from”.
Shall we leave it with this?
Well well well I see some guys here start talking about post independence time, good, I am not afraid of their comments because they use to say a same things about independence also so now they are talking about post independence time which means that they realized that independence is done deal. Well just to join your discussion, Albania just offered all their ports and roads and airports to Kosova in case of any "blockade", also Macedonia done a same thing because some how they have to, also Montenegro did a same thing because they know how much money they can get out of it, so, blockage, in actuality this will help and also will make an imperative for Kosova to united with Albania sooner then predicted because our markets will join together and we will become more inter dependent to each other where only formalities will be left to be done. I thing serbs still didn't learn the lesson from "blockages" but they still have the opportunity to learn.
Ohh the jokes continue. First it's that Kosova is a Serbian cradle and now I hear that Serbia is giving Kosova free electricity???
The only electricity that Serbia tried to export was to the Kosovar - Serbs. The Kosovar-Serbs live on hand outs from KEK and they owe over 80,000,000 Euros for not paying a single utility. It doesn't matter because they are Kosovars.
Also whomever mentioned the debts, Serbia isn't paying them anymore. Why not, I thought Kosova was a Serbian "province"?
Serbian companies are going to lose a lot since there are a few companies that directly depend on Kosovar demand to stay afloat. We all know the exp / imp is 15/14 the main concern is products coming from elsewhere through Serbia into Kosova. Somehow, I am not scared. Cuba is a great example of an embargo that sent the country into a depression---they are doing very very well.
You absoluately have no clue what are you talking about. Since when Serbia is giving free electricity to Kosova. You seem to forget and/or are not aware that we produce our own power and actually sell to our neighborhs.
Get off the subject man.
(Ahmet Isufi, 28 January 2008 11:27)
Again Ahmet you respond to a comment yes kosovo sell power to albanina at what cost? Denying your own citizens without power to make a buck, when you are selling power to albanina then you deprive kosovo citizens of power for up to 6 hours. Now i see why there are so many outage. If Serbia halts transfer of power where will it come from? Macedonia cannot export it comes from Greece and Bulgaria currently is not selling power. Montenegro gets power from Serbia. So that was just a stupid statement you made my friend remember i lived there for 2 years and i had a real good Generator for up to 4 hours without power.
there can´t be done very much to be ready for such a legal move by the righful government.
all in all, the only thing they can do is to hope for international help, which will certainly not be coming forever. and just remember how the Palestinians had to flee, because of an Israeli blockade. those measures can be very effective.
furthermore I´d love to show some of the kids in here their limitations in regard to their "argumentaion", but unfortunately the B92-censors do not post it,( as my last comment which was a direct answer on a comment adressed directly to me ) although it is in no way "including insults, indecencies, racial or national hate messages and intolerance of any kind"...
so, some mislead Tony out there will have to stay uninformed about real facts.
the reasons for that selective approach will remain to be doubtful.
if the last sentence is written in honesty:
" Hateful words are not allowed on B92’s site."
why are they publishing so many of those groundless hate-driven accusations by the k-albanians, which are already proven wrong by science, history and really independent journalism?
You forgot to say that the four horsemen of the apocalypse will descend from the heavens and visit havoc and destruction upon all those who dared to break "international law" and threaten the sovereignty of Serbia granted by the almighty himself in return for the protection of Europe from the legions of Islam in the field of the blackbirds.
You know, you scare me sometimes with your doomsday scenarios.
Jovane, your posts are not the only one that is being censored by B92, many of mine are also.
Especially when I am writing about a presidental candidate several lines of complete posts seems to disapear, no need to mention which one since he/she is out of the elections, but thats an indicator that B92 is not pro serb but also equal pro albanian.
Besides the electricity problem that will hurt us a little, everything that we buy from Serbia can be bought in Albania. Actually, it was time to stop buying anything from you guys, so that Albanian merchants take over Kosova market. Who do you think you are hurting...pfffff...what a joke. We have been having power cuts for years now, so from not having 12 hrs/day to 16 hrs/day will only make us sleep better and relax. Good luck!
Derex,
And just what makes you think we even want to join the SAA?
Serbia is defending what is hers and any other country would react the same or be even more aggressive against separatists and terrorists trying to steal 15% of its territory. What do you think the US would do if southern California tried to join Mexico? I will tell you what, they would send in the army! What would your own Holland do if separatists with high birth rates became a majority on one corner of your country and declared independence? I would like to hear your answer.
One thing you must realize is that Kosovo is Serbian, historically, culturally, geographically, linguistically, and morally. Why do you think the albanians in Kosovo have burned 150 Serbian churches, some of which are UNESCO heritage sites? Why do you think they have constructed 400 mosques? Why do Serbs live behind barbed wire in Kosovo today, why do they need military escorts to go shopping for food?
Because albanians are trying to wipe out the truth about Kosovo, trying to wipe out its history. Because of people like you who support them, they have almost reached their goal. ALMOST being the key word. Enough is enough. No more. Serbia will not give an inch of Kosovo, and will bide its time to take back sovereignty. The Russian veto guarantees Kosovo is legally Serbian, and you and those of your ilk can do nothing about that.
Please don't preach to me like you understand the balkans and know what you are talking about. What you need is a good dose of truth, and less albanian propoganda. Go visit your beloved albanians and see 'ghettos' of Serbs behind barbed wire, yes 'ghettos', which still exist in the 21'st century. Shame.
"The power Serbia has over Kosova is best noticed when walking through Mother Theresa Boulevard with the Scanderbeg Statue on the right and that of Zahir Pajaziti on the left. You have no power in Kosova and you know it.
"And guess what: A few days later, northern Kosovo asks for indepedence and Serbia and Russia recognizes it as indepedent."
This would mean that they have recognised Kosovo's independence so it should never happen.
Just because the Albanians may declare independence and have some nations recognise it, that does not mean they are independent. Only until it goes through the UN will it be achieved and as we already know it is blocked there!
So there will never be a need for the North to declare independence as the whole of Kosovo will legally remain a part of Serbia, though perhaps as occupied land.
The real risk now is that the Albanians turn on their protector's (NATO, US, etc..) as they cannot deliver their promise. This is going to get messy but it seems Serbia has the upperhand!
They have ransions of every piece of basic grocery, if you don't pay in euro which the average cuban doesn't have.
But the Castro brothers are doing just fine, same as Thaci and Cegu will after the serbian embarbo takes place.
(Srboslav, 28 January 2008 17:49)
Srbsolav I would like to prepare a proper reply but I'm not sure what a "ransion" is.
You used it here, "They have ransions of every piece of basic grocery".
"Im ready, my kids and my old mother are ready to starve for independence."
Get a grip!
Involving and encouraging the most vulnerable of society, the young and the elderly, to be part of such irrational and sick behavior is beyond description.
Some of these tit for tat comments here remind me of a vulgar spitting match.
"Then it will be the right time to take back full control of Kosovo"
So you mean if the inhabitants of a land decide to exercise their right to self determination and succeed, later on the political situation will change and let the "Serbian army ready to pounce at any minute"?
What would you say if the Hungarian army would decide and take back Vojvodina on the same basis that it belonged to Hungarians (for 900 years!), well before the Serbs settled down there?
Hopefully the political situation will never be ready for what you envisage, because Serbia would be taken apart quickly by neighbouring states with territorial claims, much more justifiable than this "cradle of our culture" thing.
nikshala: "i can insult our politicians all you want, but somehow they managed to get the support of most of the world for our independence, which is far better than the serbian politicans have managed to do!
Results speak for themselves"
I think you should post what you mean again as your sentence above doesn't make any sense.
P.S. how it comes that there are not Serbian Byzantian style churches northern then Nis. Ask yourself.
Occupying does not mean being yours.
(ben, 28 January 2008 19:30)
I am speechless.
but, if one thing is sure, than it is that those churches are all of serbian-byzantine origin.
since you say that they are albanian... why are you burning them down then?
are those who are burning serbian churches down just stupid, or are you lying?
I know that you can´t answer the only right answer: no church at should be burning. but Albanians in Kosovo are burning down churches. and that is the fact that all the world can see...
I wouldn't be so happy if I was a KS Albanian.
Even if declares indepedence and gets recognized by a few countries, nothing is going to change. UN goes, EU comes, no UN membership no athletic representations, nothing.
And guess what: A few days later, northern Kosovo asks for indepedence and Serbia and Russia recognizes it as indepedent.
I don't think it's gonna work..
One more thing: I hear some people there think they could be EU members sometime. You'd better forget it! Only Croatia and may be Serbia will. The rest of them, no way.
You can ask Mr Sarkozy if you have any doubts.
You have one chance to get things better for you. And that's Mr Nikolic to win the elections.
"… many…Castro and Cuba and their system but I am not one of them... Cuba is a very mislead country where the President and his brother have everything and the people practicly nothing. It was not without reason that Castro and Tito was good friends."
Don't believe in American propaganda. Cubans, as well as the rest of South American continent are victims of American foreign policy in the same way as we are, but they are enduring it much longer. It is true that average living standard in Cuba is very low compared to Western Europe, but keep in mind that Cuba is 50 years under economic embargo and isolation. It is an island with a limited natural resources. Still, believe it or not, average Cuban has much better quality of life, (average life expectancy, health, literacy, social security, nutrition, housing….), then most of the people in South American countries who's governments are in friendly relations with US, and blindly follow US economic "wisdom".
Involving and encouraging the most vulnerable of society, the young and the elderly, to be part of such irrational and sick behavior is beyond description.
Some of these tit for tat comments here remind me of a vulgar spitting match.
(Roger7, 28 January 2008 20:30)
Roger,
I guess you never lived in Kosova then.
Do you think that Albanians had cakes to eat during Serbian regime?
Do you think Albanians had the needed employment during Serbian regime?
So I don’t put too many “Do you-s” I will do the abbreviated version below:
Do you think that Albanians had anything during the Serbian regime?
No Roger, Albanians had none of them (nothing).
So being hungry is something that Albanians are used to.
Let me put it this way.
If you were starving for 100 years and you know that you have to endure the hunger for a bit longer what would you do?
Would you say yes to that or, would you choose to get few breadcrumbs and then stay hungry for another 100 years.
The older generation is willing to do that so they can finally breathe the long awaited air of freedom.
The young ones are willing to starve because they do not want to experience what their parents (and grandparents) have endured for a long time.
The rest (20-60) are willing to starve because they want the best for their children.
So if you still believe that this is a “vulgar spiting match”, think again.
I do appreciate that there are definitely comments put in this forum that are put just for the heck of it.
These (Uncletonny’s and Xheffo’s) are not.
These represent the will of the nation.
I guess you have to be Kosova Albanian to understand that.
1. Read the history of the Balkans as it is obvious that your knowledge is lacking.
(Tom O'Donoghue, 28 January 2008 23:27)
So I guess you have read the history of Balkans then, and that gives you the authority to judge others historic views.
I wonder which version of the Balkans History did you read (I dear to believe, the one where Balkan = Serbia, Serbia = Balkan).
Now let’s go to point nr 3
(Cease worrying about Serbian "isolation". This is a country that has a fantastic future ahead of it and only its own people will decide which way to go.”).
I will say the same about Kosova. Kosova is a country that has a fantastic future ahead of it and only its own people will decide which way to go.
And finally to point 4:
(Eliminate your arrogance which considers Holland & Western Europe to be the centre of the universe.).
So instead, everybody must accept that Serbia is the centre of the universe then, right.
But when the International Community forgets you and stops financialy helping you (and trust me they will) not even your "GREAT" polititians are going to be able to help any more even with their "excellent" tactics. But they won't suffer as much, 'cause I'm sure their bank accounts are already packed...
As you could realize Serbia does not really want that much to be in the EU club. To be honest I am glad that Netherlands did not give permission for SAA. Nonetheless, just enjoy your wealthy life in the Netherlands and let's us live in our poverty and fight for something that it belongs to us. Your knowledge on Balkan situation, especially Kosovo is very limited as I could conclude from your post referring to ex Yu. Before you post your comment, please do some extensive reading one the Serbian history. Perhaps you already have red some Albanian interpretation of the history which is full of falsified facts, or perhaps you are just informed form the very objective media. The newest falsification is assuming Serbian churches as those churches were their own.
I have no problem with your opinion and your great support for the Albanian cause but you have no right to insult Serbs. Speaking of Mladic and crimes he committed while Dutch Army was taking care of the Moslems in Bosnia,I think that Dutch have little to say or to be ashamed to talk about that event as they were directly involved and responsible as much as the Serbs were. I guess this makes us equal. Your Dutch Army did not try to do anything to prevent that crime and that was their obligation.
I wish you sometimes in the future to experience just one piece of what Serbs experience now. I wish you to face the real problems with your immigrants who will claim to live there for centuries and assume your culture as their own.
Don't bother to reply, especially don't bother to replay me with falsified so called historical facts and especially don't bother to replay explaining that Albanians are not immigrants.
LMFAO. Produce your own power??? No wonder the power is only on half the time. It's because Kosavars are producing it. Thanks for clearing that up.
You absoluately have no clue what are you talking about. Since when Serbia is giving free electricity to Kosova. You seem to forget and/or are not aware that we produce our own power and actually sell to our neighborhs.
Get off the subject man.
(Ahmet Isufi, 28 January 2008 11:27
"Kate, right now Im in middle of Prishtina, and I live here, AND yes, Im ready, my kids and my old mother are ready to starve for independence!!
(xheffo, 28 January 2008 18:45)"
Nobody's going to starve with the UDI. But the de facto border will be at the Ibar whether you like it or not.
Since 1999 Kosovo has developed into 2 separate ethnic-based societies.
Kosovo sells electricity to its neighbors while it can not provide it to its own because it is probably the only LEGAL export it bring the rest of the world. Terrorism, drugs, women, guns, and nationalism, are not really providers of GDP for a state.
KS, sorry that my english isn't the best, what I meant in my post when refering to "ransions" in Cuba I mixed up the word with another language.
I meant that you cant buy basic stuff such as milk, eggs, flour, imported goods, peterol in the stores in Cuba without a "coupon"
They have a system where each family or individual (I don't know exactly how it works) gets monthly coupons and then they can only buy a limited number of goods if they have the coupon with them.
The same system that many european countries used during WW2 when goods and merchandize were hard to get.
I know that many serbs defend Castro and Cuba and their system but I am not one of them... Yes, they have free health care and good educationsystem, but thats about it. Cuba is a very mislead country where the President and his brother have everything and the people practicly nothing. It was not without reason that Castro and Tito was good friends.
Massimo, if you like we could discuss North Korea too, but before we begin with it I would like to hear what exactly do you consider as propaganda? (From what I sad about Cuba).
so -- b92 -- good old "progressive" b92... aren't you so proud of yourselves? you regularly CENSOR (look it up) my historical/political opinions (i'm so sorry that you are the ultimate experts about ww2 and everything else) and then regularly publish put-downs and threats against those albanian "thugs." who is in control there? inquiring minds just wanna know. whatever -- you seem fully prepared for the coming regime, and i mean it w/ utmost sincerity. i am always so proud of your evolution, and how very progressive and intellectual you have become.
The blockade will happen if the Kosovo albanians insist on trying to steal sacred Serbian land. One thing we need to keep in mind is that Kosovo will always legally belong to Serbia, no matter what happens. This means that Serbia will need to build up its economy, improve the standard of living for all its citizens, and wait for the geopolitical situation in the world to change (it is already changing rapidly). Then it will be the right time to take back full control of Kosovo. What some here don't realize is that they will never have their 'greater albania', they will never have a seat at the UN, in the EU, in FIFA, no westerners would be crazy to invest there. If this is the kind of life they want for their kids, so be it. If they want to accept the fact that they live in Serbia, things will be better. I ask some of the albanian posters from Kosovo on here, are you not rejoicing in your fellow citizens' success success on the tennis courts in Australia? :))
Cheers!
(Dragan, 28 January 2008 15:55)
Wow... so how then do you expect Albanians to live with people as such? With the Serbian Army ready to pounce ("Kill")? How far can you guys go?
But one thing for sure, our government (Netherlands) will never ever allow Serbia to sign SAA without Mladich, just forget it, and as far as I can see there will be no EU and no Kosovo (there never was Kosovo, it was part of Yugoslavia not Serbia, which the latter decided to inherit all what was left from YU, but they didn't get the consensus of majority Kosovo people, which ultimately makes your request for KS dead), for the fact that Kosovo is already 9 years self-administered.
From an international stand point of view, I see Serbia isolated, in darkness of years 90s, all the countries in the region have agreed to recognize Kosovo (Albania, Macedonia, Montenegro, ...) so according to Serbian politician which said that they will take measures for the countries that recognize Kosovo, it means that Serbia will then isolate itself from the region and the world, since it won't have any diplomatic relation with the mentioned countries above.
Well, also talking about the poverty, I see a lot of Serbs are writing that Kosovo is so poor and all that, but I don't see Serbia standing much better either, actually Serbia has even another much bigger problem and that is old population which is in contrast with Kosovo, so speaking in terms of problems I think Serbia has work to do in its own backyard.
I have a message to Serbia: People like Dragan will kill your future, and your kids will inherit 90s and face the very same problems you did during the Milosevic era.
Srboslav: thank you for letting me know that I havn't created nothing in all my life- everything I have I own to you. What an arrogant and ignorance!!!
ups.. you remember what Tadic was saying just a month ago about the economic validity of Kosova???? do you remember 'Trepca is working and Belgrade is building'?
Bm-sila:
the only falsification is yours.
You should know the Albanian culture and language to judge- I know yours!!!
Albanians were always part of the Roman and then Byzantium Empire.
The Byzantium culture is Albanian culture too.
Our flag is Byzantium.
Constantine the Illyrian was ruling in Berat before becoming an Emperor and declaring the Christianity as the official religion in the Roman Empire.
The castle of Berat is of 6 hectares and has 40 Churches (yess 40) of Byzantium style.
Take a tour you don’t need visa and visit Albania. You will find in each angle Byzantium Churches even of the 4-5th century. Take a tour my friend http://www.albania-holidays.com/
Learn better your history and you will find your roots based on our history my friend.
You will find St. Cyril and Methodius trained and send to mission (by Byzantium) to civilize/Christianize the Slavs in the north (Serbs etc) using the religion as main ‘tool’, building churches in the occupied Byzantium lends by Slavs- that’s how you got the churches in Kosova- it was your UNI for civilization.
When Slavs were stronger they were penetrating Byzantium territories more in south when Byzantium had the upper hand they were going and liberating their lands in north- till today , with the independent KOSOVA.
And how would the "kosovan" governement solve the enegry crisis if Serbia decide not to give any free electricity to KEK anymore?
Of course the fat cats in Pristina already have electric generators in their luxury villas, just like the Hamas leadership in Gaza strip. But how should the people get electricity?
Buying from Montenegro is not an option considering that Montenegro themselves have frequent power cuts, and don't have the capacity to deliver electricity to 1.5 million extra people. Makedonia and Albania? Same thing here, they can sell a little, but not compensate for the loss of electricity from Serbia. Neither the transmission lines or the production can fill the void.
But it doesn't matter for the KLA leaders, they won't freaze, theyl let the people do instead. There are more and more similarities between Hamas leadership in Gaza and KLA in Kosovo. Both deserve to get fired as Donald Trump would say!
Well well well I see some guys here start talking about post independence time, good, I am not afraid of their comments because they use to say a same things about independence also so now they are talking about post independence time which means that they realized that independence is done deal. Well just to join your discussion, Albania just offered all their ports and roads and airports to Kosova in case of any "blockade", also Macedonia done a same thing because some how they have to, also Montenegro did a same thing because they know how much money they can get out of it, so, blockage, in actuality this will help and also will make an imperative for Kosova to united with Albania sooner then predicted because our markets will join together and we will become more inter dependent to each other where only formalities will be left to be done. I thing serbs still didn't learn the lesson from "blockages" but they still have the opportunity to learn.
Nick,
No you are wrong, "Elektroprivreda Srbije- EPS" does not get paid from KEK. The small amount of money that is payed to EPS comes from the European Union, not albanian authorities.
Ahmet,
The power plants Kosovo1 and Kosovo2 does not belong to KEK, EPS still legally owns them and the fight in courts over who owns them has not even started.
But still, Kosovo1 and Kosovo2 plants can not even supply Kosovo-Metohija with electricity today, to export electricity is not even thought of.
However, Kosovo2 power plant was renovated by the EU, who also payed the bill for it.
Dont talk to me about things YOU have no ide about. I know more about the electricity business than you or the KLA thugs incharge in Pristina ever will.
i can insult our politicians all you want, but somehow they managed to get the support of most of the world for our independence, which is far better than the serbian politicans have managed to do!
(nikshala, 28 January 2008 13:28)
Come on Nick, don’t be so harsh now.
Instead of insulting Serbian politicians we should thank them.
We all keep on arguing here, saying was it KLA, USA or Europe that brought Kosova to this day (the day of independence).
The fact remains that it is the “smart” politics from the “educated” Serbian government that actually did most of the work.
It is their “smart” politics that kept us fighting for the realisation of our dream.
On behalf of all Kosova Albanians I thank them.
It is the same politics today that is alienating Serbs living in Kosova from their neighbours, the same politics that is using Kosova Serbs for their political gains.
Keep on with the good work, I can see only one looser int this game and I am glad to say that is will not be Kosova.
Illegal unilateral declarations of Dependence will remain illegal and Serbia will strengthen its institutions while those of the illegal institutions will face ever greater challenges - even more form their own!
Srboslav, From east Japan To New Zeland to West Argentina and Canada, 4 corners of the world will know about Kosovo becoming the new nation and recognise that new development that will calm the balkans for a thousand years. Than we will move on and maybe have a trade war and economic monopoly of the region, what ever it takes to make the balkans a prosperous region that should be competative to even the eu bloc.
KEK pays Serbia for every MW of imported energy in hard cash. It is the Serbian energy company that owes the Kosova Transmission Network Operator millions of Euro for using the Kosova network to export energy to other neighbouring countries.
If suffering Energy cuts is the price we have to pay for independence that i think everyone in Kosova is more than fine with that.
You absoluately have no clue what are you talking about. Since when Serbia is giving free electricity to Kosova. You seem to forget and/or are not aware that we produce our own power and actually sell to our neighborhs.
Get off the subject man.
No I don't belive that you will starve. The fat cats in Pristina will make sure that the albanian people will starve, not them.
And finally the EU will have to pay the bill so the albanians won't starve due to their leaders actions.
This is normal behaviour when were dealing with politcal leaders that come from a guerilla backbground with no political experince other than violence.
Did you suddenly decide to care about the people in Kosova???
Well let’s put it this way:
You care about what happens to Kosova Albanians as much as I care about rugby.
Besides the electricity problem that will hurt us a little, everything that we buy from Serbia can be bought in Albania. Actually, it was time to stop buying anything from you guys, so that Albanian merchants take over Kosova market. Who do you think you are hurting...pfffff...what a joke. We have been having power cuts for years now, so from not having 12 hrs/day to 16 hrs/day will only make us sleep better and relax. Good luck!
You forgot to say that the four horsemen of the apocalypse will descend from the heavens and visit havoc and destrucion upon all those who dared to break "international law" and threaten the sovreignty of Serbia granted by the almighty himself in return for the protection of Europe from the legions of islam.
You know, you scare me sometimes with your doomsday scenarios.
"If suffering Energy cuts is the price we have to pay for independence that i think everyone in Kosova is more than fine with that."
Just as Serbs are now choosing prosperity over Radicals you are doing the opposite, and some of you have the cheek to mention your little "kosova" into the EU, please dont make me laugh.
"kosova" will crumble from within when the Serbian govenment shows it's hand because believe it or not Serbs have more power over you than the Americans do half way round the world.
Uncletonny: "Trust me, we are ready to even starve for our independence."
But... don't you live in the UK?! And what about the kids and old people in Kosovo? Do they have any say about whether they 'starve' for independence?
I read a truly dire report at the weekend about the average incomes in Kosovo which are something like half of what they are in Romania. People are really poor and things extremely tough - why would they want to 'starve'? A significant proportion of them are already listed as under-nourished. You are being so casual about it.
I still say that it's not too late for some sort of agreement to be drawn up. Kosovo is legally part of Serbia and a province can't just be handed independence.
There will be major ramifications for everyone if this isn't sorted out in a mutally acceptable fashion.
If UDI is declared there will be immediate partition, embargoes and a diplomatic nightmare internationally.
Its only fair to respond back to person calling all Albanians thugs.
You serboslav and your thugs in Belgrade don't have a clue what is going on in your own yard let alone Kosova.
You know, I see both sides "fighting" a never-ending battle here, everyday!
A small generator (2.5kw) costs 40-45 euros on the market, so people will not starve for "power", on the othe side I see kosovo market is floded with serbian products, although its a 2 mil people market, with the blockade serbia will have to find another 2 mil to sell it to. Kosovars are used to not having power, I dont think there was a day in the last 9 yrs when a day went without power! I dont belong to either side, but have been on the ground for 9 yrs and I know thing or two. As for KLA, you ppl have to stop to bring them up everytime you criticize, they are GONE, been gone for 8 yrs! WAKE UP AND SMELL THE COFFEE, there is no turning back! There are planty of buckets around to carry "power" from the neighbours :)
Serbian government knows that Kosovo is not surrounded by Serbia, right.
So, a blockade from the “north-north/east and east” is a “blockade from the north-north/east and east” (it does what it says on the tin).
Can somebody enlighten me on geography a bit please?
Doesn’t that leave………………south, part of the west and south east free?
Has somebody informed Serbian government that there seem to be a slight flaw in their plan?
They should of occupied Macedonia, Montenegro and Albania before they thought of this.
Again geography is not my strong point but does that not mean that we can do business with the rest of the word!
Not all the roads go through Serbia, there are one or two that bypass them (believe it or not).
Ohh the jokes continue. First it's that Kosova is a Serbian cradle and now I hear that Serbia is giving Kosova free electricity???
The only electricity that Serbia tried to export was to the Kosovar - Serbs. The Kosovar-Serbs live on hand outs from KEK and they owe over 80,000,000 Euros for not paying a single utility. It doesn't matter because they are Kosovars.
Also whomever mentioned the debts, Serbia isn't paying them anymore. Why not, I thought Kosova was a Serbian "province"?
Serbian companies are going to lose a lot since there are a few companies that directly depend on Kosovar demand to stay afloat. We all know the exp / imp is 15/14 the main concern is products coming from elsewhere through Serbia into Kosova. Somehow, I am not scared. Cuba is a great example of an embargo that sent the country into a depression---they are doing very very well.
1. Read the history of the Balkans as it is obvious that your knowledge is lacking.
(Tom O'Donoghue, 28 January 2008 23:27)
So I guess you have read the history of Balkans then, and that gives you the authority to judge others historic views.
I wonder which version of the Balkans History did you read (I dear to believe, the one where Balkan = Serbia, Serbia = Balkan).
Now let’s go to point nr 3
(Cease worrying about Serbian "isolation". This is a country that has a fantastic future ahead of it and only its own people will decide which way to go.”).
I will say the same about Kosova. Kosova is a country that has a fantastic future ahead of it and only its own people will decide which way to go.
And finally to point 4:
(Eliminate your arrogance which considers Holland & Western Europe to be the centre of the universe.).
So instead, everybody must accept that Serbia is the centre of the universe then, right.
Do you know how much Serbia pays each day Kosovo's debts? You don't know obviously since you can spread here such nonsense. Besides Serbia does not owe anything to Albanians in Kosovo since everything over there that you have it is built by Serbia and therefore Serbia is the owner. Unfortunately Albanians were not involved in Kosovo development but in Kosovo destruction by all means. Perhaps our churches and monasteries too are in your possession, since you assumed as yours and presenting them as the part of the Albanian-Byzantine culture. That is the newest falsification of history.
Let’s see how ingenious Albanians are to overcome the blockade. I have no doubts, there is always solution but the question is how painless will be.
The power Serbia has over Kosova is best noticed when walking through Mother Theresa Boulevard with the Scanderbeg Statue on the right and that of Zahir Pajaziti on the left. You have no power in Kosova and you know it.
Brumsila,
Power Plant Kosova "B" which supplies Kosova with most of its energy and the existing transmission netowrk was constructed using funds from the "Fund for Undeveloped Regions" of the SFRJ. Kosova benefited from that fund as a federal entity. Serbia had nothing to do with it except contribute its "share" of the money in the concerned fund.
When the Austro-Hungarian empire imposed a blockade against Serbia, in the long run it did Serbia a favour as it sought and found other markets and made its economy more versatile. This in an age with much more primitive transport and communication infrastructure and limited markets.
If Serbia decides to take such steps, Kosovo will have short-term difficulties, but as in the example above, it will probably benefit in the long run. The same goes for Serbia. The companies that export to Kosovo will suffer until they find somewhere else to sell.
No doubt the blockade will be damaging to both sides but it will not change the end result regarding Kosovo's status.
Tim,
I don't know how familiar you are with Kosovo in the 1990s but Kosovars survived despite Serbia, not because of it!
However, just to add that your Illyrian history you can sell out to someone who has no clue who the Albanians really are.
(bmrusila, 28 January 2008 16:53)
Bmrusila,
I thought that it was only Jovan allowed to give history lessons about Albanian history.
Well, it seems that you decided to join the academic elite.
In all the honesty I prefer you more than I did Jovan.
However I am going to say the same thing I told him.
Please do not waste our time trying to elaborate on the history of Albanians as viewed by Serbian historians.
“We know who our ancestors are” and “you know where you came from”.
Shall we leave it with this?
"It is nothing against your culture but simply for safety reasons".
(bmrusila, 28 January 2008 16:53)
bmrusila: this summer Albania was visited by more then 1 million foreign tourists. Dalema, the Italian foreign minister is the habitué frequenter of the Albanian costs.
So just don't worry visit Albania and- enjoy the authentic ancient Mediterranean culture.
P.S. how it comes that there are not Serbian Byzantian style churches northern then Nis. Ask yourself.
Occupying does not mean being yours.
They have ransions of every piece of basic grocery, if you don't pay in euro which the average cuban doesn't have.
But the Castro brothers are doing just fine, same as Thaci and Cegu will after the serbian embarbo takes place.
(Srboslav, 28 January 2008 17:49)
Srbsolav I would like to prepare a proper reply but I'm not sure what a "ransion" is.
You used it here, "They have ransions of every piece of basic grocery".
"Then it will be the right time to take back full control of Kosovo"
So you mean if the inhabitants of a land decide to exercise their right to self determination and succeed, later on the political situation will change and let the "Serbian army ready to pounce at any minute"?
What would you say if the Hungarian army would decide and take back Vojvodina on the same basis that it belonged to Hungarians (for 900 years!), well before the Serbs settled down there?
Hopefully the political situation will never be ready for what you envisage, because Serbia would be taken apart quickly by neighbouring states with territorial claims, much more justifiable than this "cradle of our culture" thing.
You forgot to say that the four horsemen of the apocalypse will descend from the heavens and visit havoc and destruction upon all those who dared to break "international law" and threaten the sovereignty of Serbia granted by the almighty himself in return for the protection of Europe from the legions of Islam in the field of the blackbirds.
You know, you scare me sometimes with your doomsday scenarios.
"This is normal behaviour when were dealing with politcal leaders that come from a guerilla backbground with no political experince other than violence.
(Srboslav, 28 January 2008 12:41) "
i can insult our politicians all you want, but somehow they managed to get the support of most of the world for our independence, which is far better than the serbian politicans have managed to do!
Headline of the article is "Kosovo readies for blockade", ready means whatever it takes! And by now, serb-camp should realise, as all democratic countries in a world that Kosovars are peace loving people and KNOW what they want.
I accept as true that some on this forum may eventually be experts in the electricity business however I believe that (perhaps because of that and their accumulated hate) they are at the same time missing the point here. We are not talking about markets. A new country becoming independent after decades of starving under some cruel and illegitimate rule is about diplomacy, negotiation, alliances, power, momentum, … and luck. We should all wish luck to Kosovo. Serbia is not going to be better off when Kosovars are starving. It didn’t work and it’s not working!
nikshala,
I am not insulting your leaders, every word of what I wrote is truth. Both Thaci and Cegu ARE former guerilla leaders with no political experience. And both have a history of violence, Cegu in Krajina and Thaci in Kosovo.
Is that is a good experience for current politicans? No, not if you ask me, but you might se it differently.
And you are very wrong, most of the world does not support Kosovo independence, a few EU countries + USA and Taiwan does not make up most of the world. Infact most countries are against illegal independece for Kosovo
Involving and encouraging the most vulnerable of society, the young and the elderly, to be part of such irrational and sick behavior is beyond description.
Some of these tit for tat comments here remind me of a vulgar spitting match.
(Roger7, 28 January 2008 20:30)
Roger,
I guess you never lived in Kosova then.
Do you think that Albanians had cakes to eat during Serbian regime?
Do you think Albanians had the needed employment during Serbian regime?
So I don’t put too many “Do you-s” I will do the abbreviated version below:
Do you think that Albanians had anything during the Serbian regime?
No Roger, Albanians had none of them (nothing).
So being hungry is something that Albanians are used to.
Let me put it this way.
If you were starving for 100 years and you know that you have to endure the hunger for a bit longer what would you do?
Would you say yes to that or, would you choose to get few breadcrumbs and then stay hungry for another 100 years.
The older generation is willing to do that so they can finally breathe the long awaited air of freedom.
The young ones are willing to starve because they do not want to experience what their parents (and grandparents) have endured for a long time.
The rest (20-60) are willing to starve because they want the best for their children.
So if you still believe that this is a “vulgar spiting match”, think again.
I do appreciate that there are definitely comments put in this forum that are put just for the heck of it.
These (Uncletonny’s and Xheffo’s) are not.
These represent the will of the nation.
I guess you have to be Kosova Albanian to understand that.
"The power Serbia has over Kosova is best noticed when walking through Mother Theresa Boulevard with the Scanderbeg Statue on the right and that of Zahir Pajaziti on the left. You have no power in Kosova and you know it.
If your ready to starve for indep, then starve. You dreams of indep over shadow the reality of what it takes to be an indep state. Investments are pouring into Serbia all the time. Its only a matter of time before the people turn on their heros in Prirtina because their starving. Kosovo is not ready to be indep because it has no economy to support it. If Serbia puts a total blockade on Kosovo it will cripal the almost nonexistant economy there. So if indep is more important than future stability, you cant blame Serbia for Pristinas failure in securing a normal future for its people since indep is the only thing that unites the people.
The blockade will happen if the Kosovo albanians insist on trying to steal sacred Serbian land. One thing we need to keep in mind is that Kosovo will always legally belong to Serbia, no matter what happens. This means that Serbia will need to build up its economy, improve the standard of living for all its citizens, and wait for the geopolitical situation in the world to change (it is already changing rapidly). Then it will be the right time to take back full control of Kosovo. What some here don't realize is that they will never have their 'greater albania', they will never have a seat at the UN, in the EU, in FIFA, no westerners would be crazy to invest there with the Serbian army ready to pounce at any minute, they will never be able to live at ease. If this is the kind of life they want for their kids, so be it. If they want to accept the fact that they live in Serbia, things will be better. I ask some of the albanian posters from Kosovo on here, are you not rejoicing in your fellow citizens' success success on the tennis courts in Australia? :))
Cheers!
I wouldn't be so happy if I was a KS Albanian.
Even if declares indepedence and gets recognized by a few countries, nothing is going to change. UN goes, EU comes, no UN membership no athletic representations, nothing.
And guess what: A few days later, northern Kosovo asks for indepedence and Serbia and Russia recognizes it as indepedent.
I don't think it's gonna work..
One more thing: I hear some people there think they could be EU members sometime. You'd better forget it! Only Croatia and may be Serbia will. The rest of them, no way.
You can ask Mr Sarkozy if you have any doubts.
You have one chance to get things better for you. And that's Mr Nikolic to win the elections.
"Im ready, my kids and my old mother are ready to starve for independence."
Get a grip!
Involving and encouraging the most vulnerable of society, the young and the elderly, to be part of such irrational and sick behavior is beyond description.
Some of these tit for tat comments here remind me of a vulgar spitting match.
Cutting off electricity, economic blockade, whatever.
The Serbian government has devised an action plan in the event of a UDI. Nothing that any of us say on this forum will change that. Nor will it change anything that Thaci & Co decide to do. So let things take their course and it will become apparent who is bluffing. After all, Serbia can stand on its own two feet unlike Kosovo which is a basket case living on charity.
Two things that will have an effect on all this:
1. The international economy is very rocky and unstable. An international recession is looming. In such a situation, Kosovo will no longer be able to rely on continuing handouts.
2. George Bush and his cronies are on the way out. The day of the neo-cons is over. Do not underestimate the importance of this to US foreign policy.
nikshala: "i can insult our politicians all you want, but somehow they managed to get the support of most of the world for our independence, which is far better than the serbian politicans have managed to do!
Results speak for themselves"
I think you should post what you mean again as your sentence above doesn't make any sense.
LMFAO. Produce your own power??? No wonder the power is only on half the time. It's because Kosavars are producing it. Thanks for clearing that up.
You absoluately have no clue what are you talking about. Since when Serbia is giving free electricity to Kosova. You seem to forget and/or are not aware that we produce our own power and actually sell to our neighborhs.
Get off the subject man.
(Ahmet Isufi, 28 January 2008 11:27
if economic blockade will be enforced, the law of supply and demand will tell us that demand will be high, supply will be low so the price will be high. people has nothing to eat and they freeze in the cold without electricity, chaos will follow. then we have a new gaza in the balkans.
The newest falsification of the history by the Albanians is their claim of Serbian orthodox churches and monasteries as their own- Albanian Byzantine ? You should do some reading and educate for yourself. Why do you print brochures and introduce Serbian cultural heritage as the Albanian Byzantine culture. Please, that is called falsification.
so -- b92 -- good old "progressive" b92... aren't you so proud of yourselves? you regularly CENSOR (look it up) my historical/political opinions (i'm so sorry that you are the ultimate experts about ww2 and everything else) and then regularly publish put-downs and threats against those albanian "thugs." who is in control there? inquiring minds just wanna know. whatever -- you seem fully prepared for the coming regime, and i mean it w/ utmost sincerity. i am always so proud of your evolution, and how very progressive and intellectual you have become.
You absoluately have no clue what are you talking about. Since when Serbia is giving free electricity to Kosova. You seem to forget and/or are not aware that we produce our own power and actually sell to our neighborhs.
Get off the subject man.
(Ahmet Isufi, 28 January 2008 11:27)
Again Ahmet you respond to a comment yes kosovo sell power to albanina at what cost? Denying your own citizens without power to make a buck, when you are selling power to albanina then you deprive kosovo citizens of power for up to 6 hours. Now i see why there are so many outage. If Serbia halts transfer of power where will it come from? Macedonia cannot export it comes from Greece and Bulgaria currently is not selling power. Montenegro gets power from Serbia. So that was just a stupid statement you made my friend remember i lived there for 2 years and i had a real good Generator for up to 4 hours without power.
there can´t be done very much to be ready for such a legal move by the righful government.
all in all, the only thing they can do is to hope for international help, which will certainly not be coming forever. and just remember how the Palestinians had to flee, because of an Israeli blockade. those measures can be very effective.
furthermore I´d love to show some of the kids in here their limitations in regard to their "argumentaion", but unfortunately the B92-censors do not post it,( as my last comment which was a direct answer on a comment adressed directly to me ) although it is in no way "including insults, indecencies, racial or national hate messages and intolerance of any kind"...
so, some mislead Tony out there will have to stay uninformed about real facts.
the reasons for that selective approach will remain to be doubtful.
if the last sentence is written in honesty:
" Hateful words are not allowed on B92’s site."
why are they publishing so many of those groundless hate-driven accusations by the k-albanians, which are already proven wrong by science, history and really independent journalism?
The last post of mine was for you but I forgot to name you when replayed. However, just to add that your Illyrian history you can sell out to someone who has no clue who the Albanians really are. When it comes to visiting Albania, I prefer holiday in Turkey as I can be sure that I will be back in one piece and alive. Nonetheless, thank you for invitation, but think I will have to wait many years before I can feel really safe while visiting Albania. It is nothing against your culture but simply for safety reasons.
"And guess what: A few days later, northern Kosovo asks for indepedence and Serbia and Russia recognizes it as indepedent."
This would mean that they have recognised Kosovo's independence so it should never happen.
Just because the Albanians may declare independence and have some nations recognise it, that does not mean they are independent. Only until it goes through the UN will it be achieved and as we already know it is blocked there!
So there will never be a need for the North to declare independence as the whole of Kosovo will legally remain a part of Serbia, though perhaps as occupied land.
The real risk now is that the Albanians turn on their protector's (NATO, US, etc..) as they cannot deliver their promise. This is going to get messy but it seems Serbia has the upperhand!
Jovane, your posts are not the only one that is being censored by B92, many of mine are also.
Especially when I am writing about a presidental candidate several lines of complete posts seems to disapear, no need to mention which one since he/she is out of the elections, but thats an indicator that B92 is not pro serb but also equal pro albanian.
P.S. how it comes that there are not Serbian Byzantian style churches northern then Nis. Ask yourself.
Occupying does not mean being yours.
(ben, 28 January 2008 19:30)
I am speechless.
but, if one thing is sure, than it is that those churches are all of serbian-byzantine origin.
since you say that they are albanian... why are you burning them down then?
are those who are burning serbian churches down just stupid, or are you lying?
I know that you can´t answer the only right answer: no church at should be burning. but Albanians in Kosovo are burning down churches. and that is the fact that all the world can see...
Derex, I think you should:
1. Read the history of the Balkans as it is obvious that your knowledge is lacking.
2. Get over the fact that your "peacekeepers" failed in every respect in Bosnia.
3. Cease worrying about Serbian "isolation". This is a country that has a fantastic future ahead of it and only its own people will decide which way to go.
4. Eliminate your arrogance which considers Holland & Western Europe to be the centre of the universe.
As you could realize Serbia does not really want that much to be in the EU club. To be honest I am glad that Netherlands did not give permission for SAA. Nonetheless, just enjoy your wealthy life in the Netherlands and let's us live in our poverty and fight for something that it belongs to us. Your knowledge on Balkan situation, especially Kosovo is very limited as I could conclude from your post referring to ex Yu. Before you post your comment, please do some extensive reading one the Serbian history. Perhaps you already have red some Albanian interpretation of the history which is full of falsified facts, or perhaps you are just informed form the very objective media. The newest falsification is assuming Serbian churches as those churches were their own.
I have no problem with your opinion and your great support for the Albanian cause but you have no right to insult Serbs. Speaking of Mladic and crimes he committed while Dutch Army was taking care of the Moslems in Bosnia,I think that Dutch have little to say or to be ashamed to talk about that event as they were directly involved and responsible as much as the Serbs were. I guess this makes us equal. Your Dutch Army did not try to do anything to prevent that crime and that was their obligation.
I wish you sometimes in the future to experience just one piece of what Serbs experience now. I wish you to face the real problems with your immigrants who will claim to live there for centuries and assume your culture as their own.
Don't bother to reply, especially don't bother to replay me with falsified so called historical facts and especially don't bother to replay explaining that Albanians are not immigrants.
Kosovo sells electricity to its neighbors while it can not provide it to its own because it is probably the only LEGAL export it bring the rest of the world. Terrorism, drugs, women, guns, and nationalism, are not really providers of GDP for a state.
"Kate, right now Im in middle of Prishtina, and I live here, AND yes, Im ready, my kids and my old mother are ready to starve for independence!!
(xheffo, 28 January 2008 18:45)"
Nobody's going to starve with the UDI. But the de facto border will be at the Ibar whether you like it or not.
Since 1999 Kosovo has developed into 2 separate ethnic-based societies.
KS, sorry that my english isn't the best, what I meant in my post when refering to "ransions" in Cuba I mixed up the word with another language.
I meant that you cant buy basic stuff such as milk, eggs, flour, imported goods, peterol in the stores in Cuba without a "coupon"
They have a system where each family or individual (I don't know exactly how it works) gets monthly coupons and then they can only buy a limited number of goods if they have the coupon with them.
The same system that many european countries used during WW2 when goods and merchandize were hard to get.
I know that many serbs defend Castro and Cuba and their system but I am not one of them... Yes, they have free health care and good educationsystem, but thats about it. Cuba is a very mislead country where the President and his brother have everything and the people practicly nothing. It was not without reason that Castro and Tito was good friends.
But when the International Community forgets you and stops financialy helping you (and trust me they will) not even your "GREAT" polititians are going to be able to help any more even with their "excellent" tactics. But they won't suffer as much, 'cause I'm sure their bank accounts are already packed...
Derex,
And just what makes you think we even want to join the SAA?
Serbia is defending what is hers and any other country would react the same or be even more aggressive against separatists and terrorists trying to steal 15% of its territory. What do you think the US would do if southern California tried to join Mexico? I will tell you what, they would send in the army! What would your own Holland do if separatists with high birth rates became a majority on one corner of your country and declared independence? I would like to hear your answer.
One thing you must realize is that Kosovo is Serbian, historically, culturally, geographically, linguistically, and morally. Why do you think the albanians in Kosovo have burned 150 Serbian churches, some of which are UNESCO heritage sites? Why do you think they have constructed 400 mosques? Why do Serbs live behind barbed wire in Kosovo today, why do they need military escorts to go shopping for food?
Because albanians are trying to wipe out the truth about Kosovo, trying to wipe out its history. Because of people like you who support them, they have almost reached their goal. ALMOST being the key word. Enough is enough. No more. Serbia will not give an inch of Kosovo, and will bide its time to take back sovereignty. The Russian veto guarantees Kosovo is legally Serbian, and you and those of your ilk can do nothing about that.
Please don't preach to me like you understand the balkans and know what you are talking about. What you need is a good dose of truth, and less albanian propoganda. Go visit your beloved albanians and see 'ghettos' of Serbs behind barbed wire, yes 'ghettos', which still exist in the 21'st century. Shame.
"… many…Castro and Cuba and their system but I am not one of them... Cuba is a very mislead country where the President and his brother have everything and the people practicly nothing. It was not without reason that Castro and Tito was good friends."
Don't believe in American propaganda. Cubans, as well as the rest of South American continent are victims of American foreign policy in the same way as we are, but they are enduring it much longer. It is true that average living standard in Cuba is very low compared to Western Europe, but keep in mind that Cuba is 50 years under economic embargo and isolation. It is an island with a limited natural resources. Still, believe it or not, average Cuban has much better quality of life, (average life expectancy, health, literacy, social security, nutrition, housing….), then most of the people in South American countries who's governments are in friendly relations with US, and blindly follow US economic "wisdom".
Massimo, if you like we could discuss North Korea too, but before we begin with it I would like to hear what exactly do you consider as propaganda? (From what I sad about Cuba).
IMAGE SOURCE
68 Komentari
Sortiraj po: